An idiot mechanic’s Opinion on Shimano 12 Sp 105, Ultegra & Dura-Ace

Here's a hot take from a professional bike mechanic of over 13 years and counting. Over the following years mechanical shifting will go away and then come back like Swiss watches as a premium item. Electronic shifting will become like cheap digital watches and be cheap because the same switches, batteries and motors can be used in all trim levels of shifting and only the external part materials and their weight will determine the level of quality of shifting parts. The only reason why the electronic stuff costs so much right now is that it is marketed as premium when in reality the biggest cost cutting will be in the electronic shifting. Electronics will be shared in all price points leading to overall lower cost to manufacture as opposed to having to produce loads of tiny parts for shift lever mechanisms to different tolerances out of different materials. So my prediction is that in the future the premium level bikes will have really nicely made mechanical stuff most likely marketed as authentic feel or some shit like that and electronics will be the bog standard in every price level. It will take time to get there but it sure looks like the future right now when you consider the speed that people are willing to buy the electronic junk in shifting and e-bikes etc. The trend seems to be that adding a battery and electronic function is somehow sought after at the moment and mainstream consumers are lapping it up no questions asked. Of course there will always be some Far-East factory making parts for whatever is the most common old mechanical item on the market at the most lowest price possible out of garbage materials. But when it comes to new western world quality level consumer bikes the trend will be as I described above. The biggest joke this far that I have seen is this in the same bike: (Number is the amount of batteries) E-bike battery (1) Sram Flight attendant shock + fork + crank spindle sensor (3) Sram AXS Shifting 1-by (2) Sram AXS dropper post (2) Add into that the common stuff like: Bike computer (1) Battery operated front + rear light (2) Complete bike ready to ride with accessories has 11 batteries to keep track of by charging or swapping as needed. Must be fun preparing for a ride with that bike. I do not like where the bike industry is heading and will keep riding my mechanical drivetrains as long as I can, but it will get increasingly more difficult as time passes and planned incompatibility and dwindling spare parts supply creep forward.

This has quickly become one of my favorite channels. Well reasoned opinions, rational and balanced (things like value for money taken into account, serviceability and fit for purpose depending on type or style of riding). Majority of the 'objective opinions' expressed by YT channels are actually largely unsubstantiated preferences (often by dyed in wool roadies or touring cyclists prone who blindly favor tradition over progression) or equally groanworthy , totally biased 'objective sponsored content'. Having preferences is fine, but shoving it down our throats as an absolute truth is grating. Kudos to you and others of your ilk (Peak Torque, Hambini etc).

100% agree on the gearing issues on bikes, and often wondered why they don't offer the 46/30 (x 12/13-36?) in 105- lets face it most bikes are massively over geared and they don't seem to consider that some of us live in places like the Scottish Highlands where descending at 70km/h is FAR less important than getting up a long steep hill, many of us are not that young, or are not the "perfect weight"... I've an old Carrera TDF that has only the original frame left on it now( Triggers Brush springs to mind...) which came with 2x7 Tourney and a lowest of 34/28 on a 12.5kg bike, that's now got (ebay) Tiagra 4600 on it so I could run a M-592 MTB mech on it and it has a low of 34/36 but I'm planning an 11-40 cassette as it will handle it easily.... and when the chainrings go eventually I'll probably put on FSA Tempo 46/30...It's my winter bike now, My better bike for summer has Sora R3000 ironically with the same derailleur, and I've split 2 and built a USABLE cassette 14-36...... (but got a 105 groupset from CRC for £299 for "future proofing", keep it in storage for now lol)

Still very happy with my Ultegra 11 spd mechanical set. Every shift is bang on. Why bin the 105 mechanical option, Shimano? Past Ultegra would have made a superb new 105 and not force customers to a much more expensive purchase of an electronic groupset no one needs.

After watching this very insightful view into the new electronic groupsets and disc brakes im so pleased i bought a couple of R7000 105 rim brake groupsets when they were £300 on Wiggle...thats me sorted until Tiagra comes out as 11 speed for replacement parts. No messing with batteries or recoding/downloading anything, just a new cable and good to go 👍🏻 Love the channel btw, nice to see someone down to earth talking about the bike industry...keep it up 🎉

I'll stick to 9-speed mechanical, easy to maintain, mix and matchable, reliable and affordable.

Excellent Q’s and comments. Showing once again a thoughtful, knowledgeable and wide ranging community with a diverse range of experience and opinions. Great stuff. Definitely share concerns about accessibility for younger riders, and older riders, being able to maintain accessibility to our sport regardless of whether on slicks or knoblies.

I think I'll stick with 10 speed mechanical Dura Ace and Record thanks - too many electronic gimmicks in the world, I don't need more on my bikes.

I think you've hit it all spot-on. Too many of current developments are moving towards less compatibility and more future obsolesence. Even simple things like 3rd party cranks & chainrings, let alone the difficulties of all the electronics. Once upon a time, Shimano were the epitome of cross-compatibility between groupsets and raod/MTB kit. And what ordinary cyclist needs an 11t or 10t small cog? I've run 50 or 48 x 12 on road bikes for years, and theat hasn't slowed me down on even big alpine descents (and I've only ever come across 1 amateur rider faster than me downhill). Personally, I'm a dedicated Campag fan for road bikes. I've found it bullet-proof reliable, easy to set up and needs no adjustment after intial bedding in. Never got on with the ergonomics & haptics of Shimano. I have just fitted Rival ETAP/Easgle mullet to my new gravel bike, though. I'm blown away with how easy to set up that is and like you say, has the easy interface through the app (which isn't even needed for basic set-up). With the wireless, I can set up the bike easily for both drop & flat bars making the bike even more versatile. The Rival shifters also have a great shape for using on flared bars. If only they'd ditch that stupid flat-top chain and the different cassette standards (XD/XDR) to make the system even more cross-compatibile.

I’ve mentioned this many times before here and elsewhere. A class action right to repair lawsuit needs to be brought against Shimano and the others, due to the extreme cost of these electronic parts. Mandate that they sell every part of a derailleur etc as well as tools to do the job. Also Shimano should be mandated to provide a regional repair center where these parts can be sent for repair, or exchanged for a refurbed model when damaged beyond repair.

I agree with you about gear ratios. I'm using 46/30 and 14/40 with 105 R7000 (front mech is Ultegra). I live in Taipei (lots of mountains) and constantly hit 10%+, 15%+ and more often than not 20%+. The original 50/34 and 11/34 wasn't nearly as low as I needed to explore the many small roads around here. Judging by the number of cyclists I met in the main roads (usually with more reasonable gradients) and the number of cyclists I met in the secondary and tertiary roads (usually with crazy gradients), more people would benefit from lower gears to be able to explore the quieter roads. My knees and my heart loved the change. My chain too, because I can have a better chainline for more time. I don't care at all about pedalling at 60km/h. Not wanting to win any race here.

The computer analogy is brilliant, loved it!

I love my Campy Chorus 12 speed. No electric issues, all the range, looks fantastic, sounds great, and is more reliable than the Shimano on my MTB. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea, but I'm now a Campy fanboy.

I love this video, speak facts. Updated last week to 105 Di2 and i love it

Just discovered the channel breath of fresh air. Now subscribed.

My main issue is they stopped making 11s mechanical rim brake one evolution cycle to early. They should also announce and commit to making 11s 105 and Ultegra mechanical rim brake parts for a guaranteed period minimum of 7-10 years.

I like these opinion vids, keep them up. It's interesting to hear the frustration from the mechanics point of view. I have similar rants. Especially about proprietary connectors 😂 I totally agree with your comments about mechanical 105 and Tiagra. I have both (with hydraulic discs) on my bikes and both have been faultless for years. I've never run out of gears (nor for that matter on my mountain bikes over the years)... (Except on my 3 speed Brompton, but that's a whole other problem 😂). However, I do covet lovely, shiny, expensive stuff tho, so maybe when I win the lottery I'll be able to get something with electronic Dura-Ace on it. I can dream... I would certainly like to try it out, see what the real difference is. Good luck in your hunt for diagnostic boxes and 1632 batteries 😂👍

Like this video format 👍 Repair prices quickly get expensive with these new Shimano groupsets. A customer of mine recently broke a 12sp ultegra rear mech and it cost just shy of £400 to get the bike back on the road. That did include a new hanger and some work on the rear wheel (spokes, truing, retentioning) but the significant cost was in the rear mech. Agree fully on the charge cable, should be USB C and the diagnostic box, stupid and impossible to purchase. Just build it into the PC or phone software.

thanks for you overview here I was thinking about the options for the Roubaix SL8 and I had decided on the 105 Sport as opposed to the 105 Di2 your overview confirmed I'm doing the right thing :)

Interesting that the new Di2 Groupsets are very competitively priced for OEM manufacturers. New bike prices seem to be less than I expected.