Wisdom in the Age of AI: A Philosophical Quest with Vervaeke, Pageau, and Schindler

8,774
0
Published 2024-02-21
Explore the complex relationship between AI and human insight in this thought-provoking episode with John Vervaeke, Ken Lowry, Jonathan Pageau, and DC Schindler. While deeply engaging with the scientific and philosophical aspects of artificial intelligence, the panel discusses its broad implications for our understanding of consciousness, culture, and rational thought. Key points include AI's challenge to our self-perception, its potential to reshape societal norms, and the critical examination of whether AI can approach human-like wisdom and ethical reasoning. The dialogue invites listeners to contemplate AI's role in redefining human rationality, wisdom, and the foundational structures of our societies.

Ken Lowry is a dedicated explorer of the good, true, and beautiful through his channel Climbing Mt Sophia, focusing on wisdom and virtue dialogues. His work fosters key collaborations, enhancing discussions on spirituality and philosophy.

Jonathan Pageau, a French Canadian icon carver and speaker, examines symbolic patterns to reconnect modern life with traditional arts, advocating for the re-enchantment of our contemporary world through ancient wisdom.

DC Schindler, a philosopher and professor, delves into metaphysics, ethics, and cultural philosophy, examining classical philosophy's impact on modern challenges, including AI, and its influence on culture and understanding.


John Vervaeke:
Website: johnvervaeke.com/
YouTube: youtube.com/@johnvervaeke
Patreon: www.patreon.com/johnvervaeke
X: twitter.com/vervaeke_john
Facebook: www.facebook.com/VervaekeJohn/

Ken Lowry:
YouTube: youtube.com/@climbingmt.sophia
Substack: kenlowry.substack.com/

Jonathan Pageau:
Website: thesymbolicworld.com/
YouTube: youtube.com/c/jonathanpageau

DC Schindler:
Website: www.johnpaulii.edu/academics/faculty/d-c-schindler…

Join our new Patreon
www.patreon.com/johnvervaeke

The Vervaeke Foundation - vervaekefoundation.org/

Awaken to Meaning - awakentomeaning.com/


Books, Articles, Publications, and Videos
AI: The Coming Thresholds and The Path We Must Take | Internationally Acclaimed Cognitive Scientist - John Vervaeke    • AI: The Coming Thresholds and The Pat...  
Mentoring the Machines: Orientation - Part One: Surviving the Deep Impact of the Artificially Intelligent Tomorrow - John Vervaeke, Shawn Coyne www.amazon.com/Mentoring-Machines-Orientation-Arti…
Mentoring the Machines: Origins - Part 2: Surviving the Deep Impact of the Artificially Intelligent Tomorrow - John Vervaeke, Shawn Coyne www.amazon.com/dp/B0CH8W8XLF
Divination and Human Nature: A Cognitive History of Intuition in Classical Antiquity - Peter Struck www.amazon.com/Divination-Human-Nature-Cognitive-I…


Quotes

"I do not honestly see how it is possible for humans to make something that is not derivative of themselves... the idea that these things could not be either ways to increase certain people's power or parasites on our own consciousness seems to me not conceivable." - Jonathan Pageau [00:24:22]
"One of the problems that I'm seeing is that a lot of this is motivated by economic, by greed, by the capacity to be economically superior to other companies... what is actually driving AI is something like mammon." - Jonathan Pageau [00:21:39]
"I wonder whether it's possible to be intelligent without first being alive. There's something about the nature of a living thing that allows intelligence to emerge. Intelligence is a way of being before it's a way of acting and is analogous to what it means to be alive rather than just carry out functions that look like life." - DC Schindler [00:42:59]

Chapters

[00:00:00] - Opening Remarks: AI's Scope and Impact
[00:03:00] - Defining AI: Weak, Strong, and AGI
[00:18:30] - Ethical and Philosophical AI Considerations
[00:32:35] - Integrating Wisdom with AI Development
[00:41:40] - Distinguishing Intelligence and Rationality in AI
[00:51:48] - Aligning Humanity to AI-Driven Cultural Shifts
[01:23:00] - Consciousness and Technology: Extending the Human Mind
[01:42:23] - Speculating AI's Future Directions
[01:57:44] - Final Thoughts: Reflecting on AI's Complexity

All Comments (21)
  • @TheodolosQ
    DC Schindler explained a lot of how I feel about AI way better than I ever could.
  • @TheodolosQ
    The AI explosion last year is the reason I found this wonderful channel. For that I'm thankful.
  • @evo1ov3
    "Idol Problem." Pageau is spot on. Always remember what he said.
  • @TopMuffinz85
    Wow, once again I am astonished by these conversations. They are so timely and needed. If the apple vision pro becomes widely used, I'd hack it to make people watch this content.
  • @KalebPeters99
    Excited to see this! John, have you seen David Shapiro's essay on moloch and the meaning crisis? He goes over some of your work as well as Boeree's and Schmachtenberger's, and relates it to his own in the sphere of machine learning and AGI thresholds. He's right on top of the latest technical developments in this realm, and I think he'd be a fantastic addition to the conversation 🙏💕
  • @evo1ov3
    Ask yourself this question. Would Mr. Vervake still litteraly be the top mind in the world explaining this stuff. If he didn't understand Plato? 😳🤣... So wild. 😆 I love this man. In the philias sense of course.
  • @BlueBirdgg
    Just saying: You have incredible insights!!!
  • @TriggerIreland
    What an important discussion! JVs strategy of demonstrating the best of humanity to AI seems an ideal goal. But we need to be cognisant the AI is less like an emerging intelligent being and more like an emerging nation, akin to a sovereign jurisdiction (subject to the scale of the AIs parent entity and its relationship with 'Global Standards and Rules').
  • @colorfulbookmark
    I think Dr.Vervaeke and the fellows talk is helpful to understand the property of AI development and IT programmers also find learning from this talk. ChatGPT's developed company OpenAI also has committee members who have same line of opinion as Dr.Vervaeke told, it means IT programmers can have conditional reductionist view, and many programmes need to listen up the opinions. The majority of people have same common sense to development of technologies. I am sorry if my reply is becoming long length and end up this reply ^^ I learn much from Dr.Vervaeke and his book about AI, I am going to get to read all ^^
  • @GlobeHackers
    I always wonder who "we" is. Most people don't see the black boxes or the genies flitting about. Some investors might. Oh, it's Mammon, alright. AI will reflect Sapiens, and that's that. If God possesses AI, well, that would be a miracle. "I'm going to win...?" WOW! How many Indians and Chinese nationals are in the audience? This was a very intoxicating conversation with many points that align with my intuitions. Something will emerge that we can't predict. It's a fascinating subject. #influenced Who is David, I really resonated with his insights.
  • @CaesarReb
    Thanks for this John! This is great, it's a bit different, but on the same vain as LLMs, I tried Tesla's FSD (Full Self Driving) this week and I was blown away. I saw the future arrive and I could see it's limitations and issues on multiple levels (and has been keeping me up in the middle of the night!). This is also a game changer. Love this conversation, it is essential. (We need to get Elon here 😁)
  • @cameronidk2
    Grog uses LPU's “According to Groq, in similar tests, ChatGPT loads at 40-50 tokens per second, and Bard at 70 tokens per second on typical GPU-based computing systems. Context for 100 tokens per second per user – A user could generate a 4,000-word essay in just over a minute.” What is LPU, how does it work? ChatGPT The term "LPU" can refer to different concepts depending on the context in which it's used. However, in the realm of technology and computing, "LPU" isn't a widely recognized acronym with a single, definitive meaning. It could be a typo or confusion with other more common terms such as "CPU" (Central Processing Unit), "GPU" (Graphics Processing Unit), or even "TPU" (Tensor Processing Unit), each of which refers to specific types of processors designed for different computing tasks. CPU (Central Processing Unit): The primary component of a computer that performs most of the processing inside a computer. It executes instructions from programs, performing basic arithmetic, logical, control, and input/output (I/O) operations specified by the instructions. GPU (Graphics Processing Unit): User language Processing Unit what is it how does it work? ChatGPT The term "Language Processing Unit" (LPU) is not widely recognized as a standard component or technology in the field of computing or artificial intelligence as of my last update in April 2023. However, the concept can be interpreted or imagined based on similar technologies and principles used in natural language processing (NLP) and related fields. If we consider an LPU in a hypothetical sense, it would be a specialized processor or computational unit designed specifically for handling natural language processing tasks. Hypothetical Design and Functionality An LPU, in a speculative sense, would be optimized for algorithms and operations commonly used in NLP, such as: Tokenization: Breaking down text into words, phrases, or other meaningful elements. Part-of-Speech Tagging: Identifying parts of speech in text, such as nouns, verbs, adjectives, etc. Named Entity Recognition (NER): Identifying and classifying key elements in text into predefined categories, such as the names of persons, organizations, locations, expressions of times, quantities, monetary values, percentages, etc. Sentiment Analysis: Determining the sentiment expressed in a piece of text, be it positive, negative, or neutral. Language Translation: Translating text from one language to another. Speech Recognition and Generation: Converting spoken language into text (speech to text) and vice versa (text to speech). How It Could Work An LPU would likely incorporate specialized hardware accelerators optimized for matrix and vector operations, which are fundamental to the machine learning models used in NLP tasks. This could include: Custom ASICs (Application-Specific Integrated Circuits): Designed to accelerate specific types of neural network computations with high efficiency. FPGAs (Field-Programmable Gate Arrays): Which can be reprogrammed to suit different tasks and algorithms, providing flexibility alongside performance. Optimized Memory Systems: To handle the large datasets and models common in NLP, an LPU would need highly efficient memory management systems to quickly access and process data. Current Analogues In the absence of a widely-recognized LPU, tasks related to natural language processing are currently handled by general-purpose CPUs, GPUs, and more specialized processors like Google's TPUs. GPUs, in particular, are well-suited to the parallel processing requirements of machine learning and NLP tasks, offering a balance of flexibility and power. Conclusion While the term "Language Processing Unit" suggests a fascinating direction for the future of computing hardware, especially tailored to the demands of natural language processing, as of now, it remains a speculative or theoretical concept. Advances in hardware specifically designed for AI and machine learning tasks continue to evolve, and it's possible that we'll see more specialized processors like an LPU in the future.
  • @alxsmac733
    As a longtime professional working in machine learning and artificial intelligence, I can tell you this level of dialogue is sadly almost entirely non-existent. This is much appreciated, everyone.
  • @timb350
    Ironically...it requires significant intelligence...to achieve an understanding of...intelligence. Which begs the question..."what is understanding?"
  • Who's telos are we satisfying ? --Implicitly power issues emerge --ie for the few or the many ?
  • @jcoales1
    I struggle with intelligence and understanding. If an LLM doesn't understand what it's doing how can we even say it is intelligent let alone rational